Pro-vaccer bullies anti-vaccer by asking for proof of claims and citing peer-reviewed studies

Pro-vaccer bullies anti-vaccer by asking for proof of claims and citing peer-reviewed studies

PALO ALTO, CA – Pro-vaccine advocates are known for being bullies, especially when dealing with anti-vaccine advocates who make claims about the dangers of vaccines.

“All I said was that vaccines are full of toxins and that it is a FACT that they are causing the rise in chronic diseases,” explained anti-vaccer Nancy Heimer. “Then this pro-vaccine NAZI comes from out of nowhere and starts demanding that I back up my claim with evidence. These pro-vaccine crazies are nothing but online bullies.”

According to Heimer, the harassment didn’t end there. The pro-vaccine advocate, Mark Stoddart, then proceeded to post links from peer-reviewed journals proving that vaccines were safe and not causing chronic diseases.

“It was horrible, just horrible. He started posting all these links to study after study, making me look like a fool. It was harassment and bullying, plain and simple,” said a visibly shaken Heimer. “I don’t know how these people sleep at night.”

Unfortunately, this is not an isolated incident. According to Sharyl Attkisson, a former CBS reporter and now an anti-science, anti-vaccine blogger, this type of bullying and harassing goes on all the time.

“It’s what I call “astro-turfing”. Basically it’s when anyone who is pro-vaccine argues with an anti-vaccer. Their favorite thing to do is ask for “proof” and “evidence” of our claims. It’s really awful.”

Attkisson and other anti-vaccine cult members are petitioning to have all pro-vaccine comments deleted from the internet in the interest of fairness.


  • Neo

    Typical of a pro Vax Pharma shill lying troll!
    Post all the fradulant studies you want…there has never been proof vaccines work,eradicated any disease or saved anyone….NONE!
    But just look around at all the destruction vaccines have done and are doing everyday.
    Pro Vax love to spew correlation equates causation when it comes to vaccines and diseases but spout off that there is no correlation when it comes to the destruction vaccines are doing..
    LIARS is all they are !

    • Michael Aronson

      Can’t tell if serious. Blame Poe’s Law.

      • Dennis Fisher

        I fear it isn’t a poe.

      • I’m afraid it’s not Poe. It post on Mercola’s fcktoy’s page:

        Discussion on Health Nut News 18 comments
        Selena Gomez & others ‘prove’ chemo not just for cancer, it’s f…
        Neo 21 days ago
        Yeah cause chemo will help your Immune system.
        So let’s destroy the body with vaccines, GMO and fix it with chemo?
        Wow…what logic.
        Can you drink chemo?
        Than why the hell would you inject it.
        Nice boobs btw!

    • tonymacaroni

      Gotta be a Poe. Just gotta.

  • Anon

    If you initiate a controversial statement on social media then expect someone’s going to debate your points. I seen no situation of bullying here, just a typical debate. If you ask someone for evidence to back their theory, this is not bullying. If you show evidence as to why they’re wrong, this is not bullying. If you can’t handle the heat then get out of the kitchen.

    • Michael Aronson

      That’s the joke.

    • Ian Peterson

      That would depends on their tone and attitude . And it doesn’t matter what any wanker says it is all about FREEDOM OF CHOICE, or is that taken from now
      us as well

      • Michael Aronson

        You don’t get to choose to infect an entire population, sorry.

        • Neo

          Stop the vaccinating and there would be no more infecting of the population!

          • Michael Aronson

            You seem confused. Polio is completely gone, thanks to vaccinations.

          • kfunk937

            And, obs smallpox (and rinderpest*, but getting rid of a disease that afflicts non-humans might be like protecting “those people,” “over there,” and therefore of little interest to people whose privilege means they’ve never seen why preventing these diseases was a good idea in the first place…sigh). Although we’ve still got one country to go with polio (IIRC) before we can declare victory. Still, the end is in sight.

            Ain’t the prospect of that just so awesomely cool to everyone, including antivvaxxers? One more vaccine dropped from the schedule.

            Oh, wait. No. I guess they missed that part.

            *Rinderpest, gone. Its cousin, measles, is in our sights as well, with no non-human reservoir. Get on board, AVers! One less shot.

          • Neo

            Please not the polio.
            Vaccines had nothing to do with polio.
            98% of children that caught polio had minor to no ill affects at all.
            BTW correlation does not imply causation, polio being a water bourne disease was on its way out.
            Pesticides were the major contributor to paralysis.

      • CT14

        Yes, it is taken from you. Public health is no joke, and you can’t be allowed to ignore reality when it endangers others.

      • Yes, I have the freedom to choose whether I want to be exposed to some snot-nosed viral incubator, whose parents put their irrational fears above or public health.

        • Neo

          More Pharma rhetoric BS.
          It should be keep your vaccinated virus carrying snot nosed kid from spreading the diseases.
          BTW fan boy….vaccines keep causing the continuation of these childhood diseases to remain…but now they are mutating thanks to vaccines and your inoculated spawn…if you even have any!

          • Michael Aronson

            “vaccines keep causing the continuation of these childhood diseases”

            They do the opposite, in fact. If doctors wanted viruses to exist, why would they create vaccinations at all? Do you realize scientists can actually create new strains of viruses if they want?

          • Neo

            Duh..what do you think they are doing with vaccines.
            The industry is creating childhood cancers,Autisms,childhood diabetes,SIDS and the long list continues on and on and on.
            Tell me again how great vaccines are?

          • Michael Aronson

            Wow, so every country in the world is knowingly murdering people with disease very very slowly. Excellent conspiracy theory.

          • You didn’t do very well in science class, did you?

          • Neo

            No not in corrupt science,they kicked me out for calling BS on those fradulant studies.

          • Corrupt Science? Sounds like a Lifetime movie title. Probably more your speed.

      • madcapfeline

        Tone and attitude have nothing to do with it. How are you going to discern the tone and attitude of a person you’ve never met, with noting more than black text on a white background? Regardless, facts either are, or they aren’t. You do not have the freedom to choose to make up your own facts. If you state a “fact,” you have to back it up with evidence. Otherwise, it’s just BS that some charlatan made up, that you decided to parrot on the internet.

  • Ian Peterson

    doesn’t matter if you are pro or anti there is no need for bullying, next time it happens first, throat punch the wanker, then kick 2-3 times to the groin when the wanker doubles over grab him at the back of the head and proceed to raise your knees one after the other as hard as you can
    to the middle of his face till he drops bleeding profusely, now you stand there and lecture him on the anti behavior of bullying and if HE can’t handle the heat in the street stay home with mommy.

    • Anon

      This has to be a joke, asking someone to prove what they’re stating isn’t really bullying- especially when it comes to something like vaccines. I realise that bullying is basically anything that makes someone feel bad, but anti-vaccers shouldn’t be posting on the internet about the “dangers” without evidence to back their claims- you wouldn’t convict someone of murder without proof so surely you wouldn’t expect people to benignly just accept that vaccines are all toxic and dangerous…

    • Oooh, Internet tough guy. Let me get some boots so I could shake in them.

    • Neo

      Most pro vaxxers are weasels anyways hiding behind their monitoors wishing they had dick big enough to procreate.

  • Christopher Hickie

    I knew eventually the *real* reason I kicked non-vaccinating parents out of my practice would be found, and I knew it would be you, Doktor Spudd, who would sleuth it out.

    Yes, I changed my pediatric practice policy to exclude non-vaccinating parents because I just couldn’t live with being such a bully anymore. There. I’ve said it. Now I can sleep at night.

  • Drew Scerbo

    The Spudd Times (Science, Health, Satire)…

    …right at the TOP of the page.

  • dogjudge

    Let me think about this for 2 seconds. Times up.

    ANYONE with a scientific background KNOWS that you base your decisions from the FACTS that are out there.

    If you don’t have a scientific background you need to learn what the FACTS are and not just take someone’s word for it. ESPECIALLY if that person does not have a scientific background and is someone like an actor running off at the mouth.

    I swear. Some people spend more time looking for the FACTS about buying a new car than they spend on learning about drugs.

    • Anon

      I do agree with you to a certain extent but not always have scientific “facts” been correct. Sometimes you’ve got just to keep an open mind. A theory or a conspiracy could become a fact. Just because you hold the evidence doesn’t always mean you’re in the right.

      • Kerri Jordyn

        Anon, you clearly don’t really understand what a theory is. I suspect you don’t have much of a background in science, if any at all. I suggest you refrain from making such comments in the future.

      • dogjudge

        Um, there’s a thing known as conflicting theories.

        Until someone comes up with FACTS that substantiate the viability of a theory, then you don’t have a theory. All you have is supposition.

        Most importantly, you have to hold your theory and facts up to review by the scientific community.

        Hence, we know that the earth is round.

        When you hold evidence you ARE right until someone else can prove you wrong by the facts. Again, conspiracy and supposition is nothing.

      • Jan Magne Skaue

        Err! Every fact, started out as a hypothesis. The hypothesis was repeatedly tested – and if the tests concistently confirm your hypothesis over many tests – you have the grounds for a theory. For a theory to be widely acknowledged as a fact, it must stand angainst millions of repeated tests and used for many, many years – never, EVER deviating a single time. Then – MAYBE – it may be concidereded a fact by reputable peers. One single deviation of the results, which cannot be traced back to measurment, calculation or equipment failure – and you’re back at square one with a failed hypothesis.

        This is how rigid scientific studies are – for something to be considered scientifically correct, it has to prove itself correct every single time. In contrary to belief – which doesn’t really have to be proven right, even once.

  • Lindsey

    It’s so awful to ask for proof and evidence? How can you claim your info is based on FACTS but feel bullied when you are asked to produce said FACTS? The anti-vaccers are putting our childrens lives at risk. I think we as parents deserve to see the info they have to back up their claims. And I love how the article called anti-vaccers a cult…lol. Here drink my Kool-Aid. All Pro-Vaccine comments deleted…really. So we Pro-Vaccers don’t have right to our facts or opinions??

    • Chris

      “So we Pro-Vaccers don’t have right to our facts or opinions??”

      Only on Htrae, where many of the anti-reality folks live. You can find their typical online locations at AgeOfAutism, NaturalNews, GreenMedInfo, VaccinationCouncil, etc. While the addresses seem to be on this planet, there is a direct wormhole connection to Htrae.

      There is some documentation on their behavior here.

  • John

    I get the feeling people didn’t read the “science health satire” part of the title.

  • Andy Keher

    I don’t understand why people are posting huge messages shouting at the imaginary characters described in this satirical article.

    • Anon

      There’s more to it that the bed time story you seem to seek. There’s a reasoning this was posted in the eyes of an anti, the same as it could be posted in the eyes of a pro. It’s not the side you’re on, it’s the passion to protect something that you feel is right.

      • Jan Magne Skaue

        Feeling right about something, doesn’t /make/ that something – legitimate or right. I might feel right about 4 + 4 being 7, that still does not make it so. No one can prove 4+4=7, but everyone sufficiently competent at maths can prove 4+4 =8 (and thus, NOT 7)., In terms of claims of consequence, right litterally means being backed by replicable proof. Not backed by reproducable proof, its nothing more than a illegitimate claim. Anyone can make a claim, even if that claim is an intentional lie.

        • T Jensen

          Satire. Right there under the name of the publication. “Science. Health. Satire.”.

          It’s not nearly as funny as the author seems to think and it’s utterly brainless. It is, nonetheless, an attempt at satire.

          • Chris

            It is really hard to do good satire on something that is utterly ridiculous in reality.

          • T Jensen

            Which is just part of what makes this “article” nothing less than tasteless and crude.

          • Chris

            Crude, yes. Tasteless, well that is a matter of opinion, especially compared to the AoA article where the author compared getting a link to the book Neurotribes was as bad as getting child pornography. Then there are those parents (same page) who claim that having their unvaccinated children excluded from schools, especially during outbreaks, is just like how the Jews were treated by Nazi Germany. Now that is tasteless.

            As I said, it is hard to parody something that is already utterly ridiculous.

          • Jan Magne Skaue

            I was “on” the discussion reply here, not the article itself.

  • David F Mayer


  • Jim Bo Ner Mangina

    I think there is a problem with my weiner, sometimes when I go to take a pee, piss comes out. Please help.

    • Chris

      But T. Jensen thinks the above article is “crude and tasteless.” Though so far he/she has not responded how tasteless it is compared to the AoA crowd that actually think getting a link to the Neurotribes book was like being sent pornography, or comparing vaccination requirements for school attendance to how Jews were treated in Nazi Germany.

      • Tina Jones

        Really sorry I don’t live on the forums and come at the moment you call, but I’ve been elsewhere. And I’m not an “anti-vaxxer”, I simply expect entertainment pieces to be entertaining. How unfair of me.

  • Thanks for this.

  • Anon

    Yeah, then when you challenge a pro-vaccer’s claims, they get all butthurt and do the same thing. It goes both ways.

    • Chris

      Citation needed. Please make sure it is a a PubMed indexed study by reputable qualified researchers.

  • KT Harris

    Actually peer reviewed studies find pro vaccers more emotional (I read ‘bullies’) and anti are more prone to using logic, and science. But apparently this is because of overconfidence (not because they have actually done research eh (sorry being ironic here))

    • Chris

      From Facebook comments? That is not a random sample, and besides it has nothing to do with the validity of the science. By the way here is the summary:

      “not because they have actually done research eh”

      Perhaps you can educate us all and provide the PubMed indexed studies by qualified reputable researchers that any vaccine on the present American pediatric schedule causes more harm than the diseases. Just post the PMID, not an article on Epoch Times (not a peer reviewed journal).

      • KT Harris

        Oh don’t bully me. LOL. Frontiers in Psychiatry, 2017; doi: 10.3389/fpsyt.2017.00003

        • Chris

          Asking for evidence is bullying? Okay. How about actually looking at the paper in published in an open source journal with some weird history? Why is one of the authors a lawyer?

          Conclusion of that paper: “However, these findings, even if replicated in future studies, do not prove a causal role of vaccination in the pathoetiology of any of these conditions. Indeed, antecedent infections may also increase the risk of developing one or more of these disorders in vulnerable individuals. Finally, given the modest magnitude of these findings and the clear public health benefits of the timely administration of vaccines in preventing mortality and morbidity in childhood, we encourage families to maintain the currently recommended vaccination schedules while taking all necessary precautions as documented by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.”

          Did you read this paper, or did you just read about it on a random website? Because that is not real research.

      • KT Harris
        • Chris

          The Infanrix-Polio+Hib is not on the present American pediatric schedule. Also, I do not see where it had anything to do with the relative risk to actually getting Hib meningitis, polio, diphtheria, tetanus and pertussis.

          I asked if the vaccine caused more harm than the actual disease. Tetanus kills about one in ten who get it. Does that vaccine, which is not given in the USA, actually kill 10% of the kids who get it? If it does, why is it on the market.

          Are you confused by the term “more harm”? Oh, no! I am now a bully because I asked you about your grasp of elementary school vocabulary! Bad Chris, naughty Chris!

          Seriously, why do you think it is better for a child to suffer high fevers and possible complications than getting a disease?

          • FallsAngel

            Not to mention, this study had 5 babies.

          • Chris

            Thanks, I could only see the abstract. And the title even said it was in vitro, which is not actual babies.

            Seriously, why part of “more harm than” do these folks not understand?

          • FallsAngel

            I only saw the abstract as well. Here’s the relevant sentence: “Here, array technology was used to assess the expression kinetics of
            immune response genes with association to asthma and allergy in
            peripheral blood mononuclear cells (PBMC) of five healthy infants after
            vaccination with Infanrix-Polio+Hib.”

          • Chris

            Oops. Thanks. I guess I was too baffled at the vaccine, which I had never heard of… so I looked it up. I am not quite sure how allergies etc. in a petri dish cause more harm than diphtheria, tetanus, pertussis, polio and Hib.

          • FallsAngel

            Yeah, I’d never heard of that vaccine before either. I mean, we have a similar vaccine here in the US, Pentacel, but it doesn’t contain infanrix as its DTaP.

          • KT Harris

            First up I provided a study which indicated that ‘pro-vaccine’ people were prone to emotive language, this was in response to a satirical piece that was saying that “anti-vaccine” people said “pro-vaccine” were bullies for asking for evidence to back themselves. Then you changed the goal posts and said I had to come up with evidence that the present American pediatric schedule causes more harm than the diseases, which was not related to the article or my comment so I came up with two on the hop which may demonstrate some harm. I am not American so I am not sure why it has to be American. “Tetanus kills about one in ten who get it. Does that vaccine, which is not given in the USA, actually kill 10% of the kids who get it? If it does, why is it on the market.” A strange comparison as tetanus itself is very rare so if it kills 10% of those who contract it, the vaccine has to kill only more than that same number, not 10% of the total vaccinated, to be of more harm than the disease. Thank you for so diligently illustrating my points by providing no evidence for your statements, except a sciblogs article, while stooping to ad-hominem attacks and assumptions.

          • Chris

            Actually, it was an exercise to see how well you do “research.” My apologies if my question was American, but I find it better to limit it to one country. If I knew where you lived, I would have placed it there.

            I did not move any goal posts, because it was the same question. Tetanus does kill about 10%, and diphtheria kills about 5% who get it. Tetanus is in the environment, and it is only rare because we vaccinate for it to protect us from the tetanospasmin it creates:

            There have been some recent stories of kids getting both, with fatalities. Recently there were reports of a child in Australia who has come down with tetanus, and a child in Spain died from diphtheria a couple of years ago. Then there are often stories of babies dying from pertussis in the news. Which often happens when there are objections to vaccinating against the 60 day cough:

            How come you don’t know that? But I will help you by providing you some citations. I am at my limit of two links, so I will provide enough for you to find the papers through PubMed:

            Pediatrics. 2002 Jan;109(1):E2.
            Philosophic objection to vaccination as a risk for tetanus among children younger than 15 years.

            Emerg Infect Dis. 1998 Oct-Dec;4(4):539-50.
            Diphtheria in the former Soviet Union: reemergence of a pandemic disease.

            J Infect Dis. 2000 Feb;181 Suppl 1:S10-22.
            Successful control of epidemic diphtheria in the states of the Former Union of Soviet Socialist Republics: lessons learned.

            Expert Rev Vaccines. 2005 Apr;4(2):173-84.
            Acellular pertussis vaccines in Japan: past, present and future.

            BMC Public Health. 2013;13 Suppl 3:S21. doi: 10.1186/1471-2458-13-S3-S21. Epub 2013 Sep 17.
            The effect of Haemophilus influenzae type B and pneumococcal conjugate vaccines on childhood meningitis mortality: a systematic review.

            Okay, that is enough. When my soon to be married second child was a baby, I attended a mom/baby group. One mother brought her twins, and then explained they were a joy but could never replace her oldest who died from Hib meningitis a year before that vaccine was available.

            Anyway, neither of the papers you posted showed “more harm.” I am sure you think you are good at “research”, but I believe you possess that skill at the same level of knowing how to use paragraphs.

  • Kalvin

    There’s no such thing as a ‘pro vaxxer’. There are anti-vax morons…and common sense people who want to stop the dangerous nonsense. Stop legitimizing the morons. They should be criticized, marginalized and excluded from having any platform from which to spread their dangerous delusions. This is NOT A DEBATE.